cliff notes: no plumbing, it's electric!
Thoughts?
https://www.turbosmart.com/news/turbosm ... 09olJVIyoQ
new wastegate?
Moderators: The Dark Side of Will, Series8217
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ericjon262
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new wastegate?
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The Dark Side of Will
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Re: new wastegate?
Interesting... the available water cooling is kind of a trip; "Water cooled waste gate".
I don't find the argument of eliminating plumbing to be very convincing... I bet 2 feet of steel tube (or especially nylon tube) is lighter than that actuator.
I'm also curious about boost strategies. The wastegate should stay closed until boost pressure gets to the set point, then open. Due to limited drive force from a vacuum actuator, there's a finite amount of time required to open the wastegate, which means the boost control solenoid has to start applying boost pressure to the actuator BEFORE boost gets to the set point or boost pressure will overshoot the set point. Also, boost pressure minus spring pressure results in a NET force on the actuator, which means that unless the boost set point is WAY above spring load, there isn't a lot of actuator force available to open the wastegate.
Now that I talk through it, maybe the electric actuator makes sense, but from more of an evolutionary rather than revolutionary point of view. The electric actuator always has its maximum force available and probably opens much faster than the conventional actuator, so it can keep the wastegate closed longer and spool the turbo faster without overshooting the boost set point.
And reading the webpage... In a ride crazy enough to use compressed CO2 to operate the wastegate, the electric wastegate actuator is probably a weight saver.
I don't find the argument of eliminating plumbing to be very convincing... I bet 2 feet of steel tube (or especially nylon tube) is lighter than that actuator.
I'm also curious about boost strategies. The wastegate should stay closed until boost pressure gets to the set point, then open. Due to limited drive force from a vacuum actuator, there's a finite amount of time required to open the wastegate, which means the boost control solenoid has to start applying boost pressure to the actuator BEFORE boost gets to the set point or boost pressure will overshoot the set point. Also, boost pressure minus spring pressure results in a NET force on the actuator, which means that unless the boost set point is WAY above spring load, there isn't a lot of actuator force available to open the wastegate.
Now that I talk through it, maybe the electric actuator makes sense, but from more of an evolutionary rather than revolutionary point of view. The electric actuator always has its maximum force available and probably opens much faster than the conventional actuator, so it can keep the wastegate closed longer and spool the turbo faster without overshooting the boost set point.
And reading the webpage... In a ride crazy enough to use compressed CO2 to operate the wastegate, the electric wastegate actuator is probably a weight saver.
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ericjon262
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Re: new wastegate?
I had been wondering how far off this was for a while. personally, I like the idea, mainly because it reduces the number of potential boost/vacuum leak locations possible, and as you pointed out, should be much faster acting. I'd also bet that it could be programmed in a way that could new some economy gains as well.
traction control via boost cut? boost changes based on gear ratio or vehicle speed, and not as abrupt as a solenoid, could be pretty cool. I bet they'll be expensive though... and they apparently have a 20a current draw!
traction control via boost cut? boost changes based on gear ratio or vehicle speed, and not as abrupt as a solenoid, could be pretty cool. I bet they'll be expensive though... and they apparently have a 20a current draw!
"I am not what you so glibly call to be a civilized man. I have broken with society for reasons which I alone am able to appreciate. I am therefore not subject to it's stupid laws, and I ask you to never allude to them in my presence again."
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The Dark Side of Will
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Re: new wastegate?
The solenoid can be operated PWM to control any set point between zero and full boost, smoothness isn't an issue with the mechanism itself, just the control strategy. A lot of modern aftermarket systems (and probably factory systems in high power turbo cars) already have gear-by-gear boost control.
Boost cut is a slow process for traction control. A drive-by-wire throttle is a better option. I'm surprised more high end ECUs don't do cylinder-by-cylinder fuel cut, but I guess enough people like popping on overrun that ignition timing is a more common option.
20A is a lot of drive current, but not out of line with what some early (BMW S54, S62) drive by wire throttle actuators pulled.
Boost cut is a slow process for traction control. A drive-by-wire throttle is a better option. I'm surprised more high end ECUs don't do cylinder-by-cylinder fuel cut, but I guess enough people like popping on overrun that ignition timing is a more common option.
20A is a lot of drive current, but not out of line with what some early (BMW S54, S62) drive by wire throttle actuators pulled.