High Feature V6 Swap

[Shaun41178(2)]

I got mine at my local ace hardware

[The Dark Side of Will]

So while shopping for a 3.09 final drive F40 out of the UK to mimic what FieroGuru did while installing a quaife, SPEC allowed me to swap my 25lb steel flywheel for the aluminum for just the difference in price with no restocking fees etc.... They stated on the phone the aluminum one was 14-16lbs approximately.... Just received the aluminum yesterday and put it on the scales an it comes in at only 10lbs.....

SPEC Steel Saab 9-3 F40 2.8T flywheel - SS23S-4 25lbs
SPEC Alum Saab 9-3 F40 2.8T flywheel - SS23A-4 10lbs

Given the 40lb steel flywheel setup this roughly a 33% reduction in overall stack setup weight...

I know this isn't super light but do any of you have any experience running aluminum flywheels, this will be my first. This too light?

FYI: finally got the fiero back from ThaDriver with the body mods. NoMad from the gafiero.org board drove me out there to pick it up and hopefully will be joining up here...

Don't forget to add in the weight of the clutch you're using.

A stock Fiero flywheel is 14#. A stock Fiero pressure plate is also 14#. 2# for the disk and you have a 30# rotating assembly, which is an easy drive even with the 2.hate. A 9# flywheel only knocks that down to 25# overall... not a huge difference.

[The Dark Side of Will]

I think I can find arps to fit up. Do you have a source for the hardened washers? Might see if arp has some wide enough...

Not sure if an ARP large-head flywheel bolt would spread the load out enough or not...
The issue is that aluminum creeps when it gets hot. Since the bolts are stretched and holding the aluminum under constant tension, the bolts relax when the aluminum gets hot and creeps out from under them. Even Ford had problems with this on the supercharged Cobra in the early '00's. The solution is the spread the same clamp load out of the largest possible area.

Check out www.mcmaster.com for whatever fastening/washer needs you have. Doesn't have to be hardened... pretty much anything steel should cut the mustard. Check out PN 95211A190

[draven]

Ok... after finally getting 88GT back from the body man, ThaDriver, it takes him a while but his work is darn near impeccable, I've been dealing with a less than stellar cooling system for a while now with the knowledge that I'll be replacing the radiator for a griffin unit, much like Steven did. Ironically I have a pinched driver side coolant tube just like his as well and will be performing the exact same fix as well. Nevertheless, the high feature V6s all route their coolant opposite from the stock fiero path. I'd like to keep the car operational as long as possible before the final swap commences but replacing the radiator with a griffin unit that works with the high feature V6 coolant obviously creates a mismatch with the stock 2.8 routing.

To temporarily remedy this before the swap I'm considering using Gates/Goodyear flexible coolant hoses. I've never used these before and always taken a wire hanger model of my tube needs and scoured the local autoparts stores for a match or near match.

Does anyone have any input on these flexible hoses? Does the corregation impact flow? Do they collapse? Long term performance? etc..

[The Dark Side of Will]

I've used the corrugated flex hoses on my Northstar car without issues. I'm sure they don't flow quite as well as a straight hose, but it hasn't been a problem.

So the HF V6 has the waterpump inlet at the back of the engine and the outlet at the front?
I see from some of your photos that it has a compact water manifold at the back just above the bellhousing.
Seems like that could work fine on a transverse car, but would be dumb on a longitudinal car. How do the Camaro apps handle that?
Have some more detailed shots of the water mani?

V8 Roadsters PS Pump delete pulley/idler:


Flipped intercooler 180deg to make more room for turbo cross over piping, will be going with weaponX inlet/outlet fittings instead of the stock outlet which would point 'right' into PS shock tower. Also, that's the LF4 ATS-V manual transmission wiring harness 98% plugged into the LF3.

Is that not the location for the thermostat housing right above the waterpump pulley?

[draven]

here's a pic of the coolant routing from the 2010 Camaro V6 with the LLT block... which is the same block setup as all high feature v6 setups.

If I'm interpreting this correctly, the coolant comes out of the engine on the front of the engine above the pump to the high pressure side of the radiator, through the radiator, to the back of the engine, through the thermostat housing/heater hose housing, then through the block to the pump, repeat.... if I'm interpreting this correctly I would have to have the inlet 'high' side of the radiator on the fiero passenger side or cross the coolant lines like bmwguru did on his saab LP9 swap.

[The Dark Side of Will]

OMGWTF.

Yeah, looks like you either have to have your radiator made to suit or cross the lines somewhere.
What year coolant pipes do you have? The '87's and '88's have the heater circuit return on the right coolant pipe just in front of the engine, which obviously won't work for you.

I swapped from '87 coolant pipes to '86 coolant pipes in my Northstar car, because returning the heater circuit there meant that I didn't have heat until the thermostat opened. Plumbing to the Northstar's dedicated heater connections, I have heat in about 1/3 the time, which is MUCH better on cold mornings. The 3.6 should have the same needs.

[The Dark Side of Will]

I built up my oil/water HEX to waterpump inlet connection from two hose elbows and a mandrel bent SS tubing elbow. I have t-bolt clamps on it now, but could use Gates PowerGrip hose clamps to make a semi-permanent assembly. The PowerGrip is a piece of thick heavy duty shrink tube that slips in place over the end of the hose, then cinches when you warm it up with a heat gun.

RockAuto even has them. E.g. https://www.rockauto.com/en/parts/gates,32941

[draven]

Thanks for the flex joins Will... may very well be using those...

Here's some pics of bmwguru's LP9 coolant crossover solution:

[The Dark Side of Will]

Lol @ PhotoFuckIt

[draven]

Lol @ PhotoFuckIt

uggghhh…. after his monthly bandwidth is reset I'll pull these pics over to my OneDrive.

[The Dark Side of Will]

Did he upgrade his service to a pay account or are these photos affected by the conversion to pay accounts?

[draven]

Did he upgrade his service to a pay account or are these photos affected by the conversion to pay accounts?

I 'think' the new terms are 25mb of bandwidth per / some period....monthly I think because they were coming in all clear for two days as I researched the topic then they all went into blur mode...

[Shaun41178(2)]

Pics show for me

[The Dark Side of Will]

They show but they're blurry. Do you see them clearly?

[draven]

Pics show for me

If you can get them clearly, yank'em and send them to me...

Just had what Jewels would call "A moment of clarity..." I have an automatic, will be converting to manual, but this kinda shit-cans my new radiator idea until the swap is full on like donkey kong… unless I "add' a trans cooler

[Shaun41178(2)]

They look clear to me. Not sure what you mean by blurry though. They dont look pixelated or anyyhing. Give me your email daddy I'll send them the way I downloaded them

[Shaun41178(2)]

IMG_20131216_162019_661_zpsa9eedcab.jpg (32.54 KiB) Viewed 4712 times

IMG_20131216_162028_595_zps13236d8d.jpg (21.49 KiB) Viewed 4712 times

[The Dark Side of Will]

Looks like putting hose couplers under the clamp that holds the tubes to the front crossmember was not a good idea.

[draven]

Still waiting on the diesel F40 to arrive and while waiting on the two coats of POR15(semi-gloss/oem satin mind you) to cure in my frunk I began getting some unneeded parts ready for sale. One box I purchased a year to two ago I bought the front 88 tubular, wildwood, QA1 setup from Ryan/Held/Aurraut. Based on the date of original purchase from the PO at OE, 15 years ago, they were probably either Ryan or Held ( a good thing ) I decided not to go with the tubular control arms in the kit, even though they already have the lower coil over shock mount configured, because it comes with poly bushings and I'm less than enthusiastic about poly, and the bushing housing length and diameter of the LCA and UCA have no moog rubber equivalent to fit (and I bugged the crap out of their sales, support, and tech line) fresh rubber is quite stiff and if I need that much more precision I'll go spherical. Furthermore, the wilwoods are racing calipers which rattle and don't weather too well in a daily or semi-daily driven car so I've heard and the C5/C6 88 caliper adapters from ericjohn fell into my lap too...

I digress, in the box I did find one very useful piece that I'm going to attempt to recreate/improve... the 2.5" coil spring adapters:







The construction is quite simple and elegant and easily reproduceable. The ID of the welded collar inside of the 4" OD 1/8"wall pipe has a slight interference fit to the spring cup on the underside of the upper 88 crossmember spring perch. So once mounted and a few jounce sessions later they are seated in the crossmember. Mix this with a reinforced shock mount like steven did with his bilsteins and you have an massive number of spring heights and rates from hypercoil, eibach, etc..etc.. vs going with the limited and cut conical mustang II springs from qa1.

I broke out the calipers and everything is made from 1/8" plate/sheet and 4" OD / 1/8" wall tube. Note the 1"x1" welded plate inside the tube. That is to secure, in a less than stellar offset fashion, the 2.5" springs, against, or very near the far side of the housing. What is not shown is a 3.5"OD/2.5"ID machine washer that sits in the housing between the spring and the collar. The angle at which the tube is cut is 7deg which is the exact angle the outside arms of the crossmember deviate from the horizontal.

To replace the 1x1 plate spring position "thing", it should be easy to weld another collar on / above the one already there with a 2.5" ID and position either a rubber or poly spring seat or is that even needed given the simplicity of its design already..

If this were to be remade in aluminum, as each adapter weights about 1lb, I have the tools to cut and could outsource the tig'ing. Would a 5052 Aluminum collar survive a mild press fit onto the upper spring perch/cup?

Thoughts?