NEW HEADERS From the guy who brought you the truelo intake

p8ntman442 · Post by **p8ntman442** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:23 pm

link to thread, check the 21st page. http://www.fiero.com/forum/Forum2/HTML/051176-21.html

Check the for sale section for my sprint manifolds soon. :thumbleft:

p8ntman442 · Post by **p8ntman442** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:37 pm

those pics worked at first.

rube · Post by **rube** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:24 pm

Unless there's better I'll take a set.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:26 pm

p8ntman442 wrote: Check the for sale section for my sprint manifolds soon. :thumbleft:

I think that's a bad idea.

First, the sprint manifolds cost half as much as these do. Second, they're made with better materials. And third, the gain by switching to these "headers" will be negligable, if any at all.

His headers do not offer any performance value other than flow, much like the Sprint manifolds. The difference there being the Sprint's will probably flow more. Point is, both sets are not tuned to, and therefore offer no gains, by scavenging, which is where most gains from headers come from. So since they are not tuned to take advantage of the pulses, I think the higher flowing set will gain more (Though marginal), and as I said before, I think the Sprints will flow more. Furthermore, they'll be more reliable.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:30 pm

There IS better, and they're CHEAPER TOO!!!

crzyone · Post by **crzyone** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:43 pm

Aaron wrote: His headers do not offer any performance value other than flow, much like the Sprint manifolds.

I think flow is the main goal. Who needs tuned headers on a piece of shit 80s pushrod V-6?

Did you know you can gain over 5hp just by grinding the inside of the stock fiero manifolds? I imagine these will perform much better than factory exhaust.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:45 pm

crzyone wrote: I think flow is the main goal. Who needs tuned headers on a peice of shit 80s pushrod V-6?

Did you know you can gain over 5hp just by grinding the inside of the stock fiero manifolds? I imagine these will perform much better than factory exhaust.

I agree and understand, but why not spend half the money on Sprints that will gain just as much?

crzyone · Post by **crzyone** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 10:52 pm

If sprint headers are cheaper, then I doubt he will get many sales. I also think the more aftermarket suppliers, the better.

Usually you try and undercut the other guy, not offer the same product at a much higher price.... :scratch:

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Sat Aug 19, 2006 11:05 pm

I think he will get a lot of sales, because a lot of those guys are too stupid/ignorant to know. Take p8ntman for example. They see the longer primaries, the shiny black paint, and it must be better. Plus he's already established credebility with those intakes. Even though a Starship Enterprise will be easier, cheaper, look better, and offer much more performance, they just don't see it.

rube · Post by **rube** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:24 am

There IS better, and they're CHEAPER TOO!!!

I think he will get a lot of sales, because a lot of those guys are too stupid/ignorant to know.

Ignorant/stupid person here. I have an ignorant and quite possibly stupid question. Where do I put the EGR Valve? Can't really tell from those photos but will they allow the shift cables in the stock location?

Series8217 · Post by **Series8217** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 12:49 am

rube wrote:
There IS better, and they're CHEAPER TOO!!!

I think he will get a lot of sales, because a lot of those guys are too stupid/ignorant to know.
Ignorant/stupid person here. I have an ignorant and quite possibly stupid question. Where do I put the EGR Valve? Can't really tell from those photos but will they allow the shift cables in the stock location?

Those are for an automatic. Doug Chase didn't make those by the way.
There is no provision for an EGR valve.

The Dark Side of Will · Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:12 am

[This is Tech, not RFTVTW]

The Dark Side of Will · Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:16 am

Aaron wrote:
p8ntman442 wrote: Check the for sale section for my sprint manifolds soon. :thumbleft:
I think that's a bad idea.

First, the sprint manifolds cost half as much as these do. Second, they're made with better materials. And third, the gain by switching to these "headers" will be negligable, if any at all.

His headers do not offer any performance value other than flow, much like the Sprint manifolds. The difference there being the Sprint's will probably flow more. Point is, both sets are not tuned to, and therefore offer no gains, by scavenging, which is where most gains from headers come from. So since they are not tuned to take advantage of the pulses, I think the higher flowing set will gain more (Though marginal), and as I said before, I think the Sprints will flow more. Furthermore, they'll be more reliable.

I think these will work better than Sprint manifolds because they have significantly more primary length. The primaries aren't matched to anything and aren't equal length, but there is benefit to be had from the extra length.

Either set will still result in an engine with different volumetric efficiency curves from cylinder to cylinder, but I think the Trueleo headers will result in more power.

Also, the PERCENTAGE difference in length (which is what matters for tuning) appears to be smaller on the Truleos than on the Sprints.

IOW, I do think they suck, but I also think they'll work better than the other options...

Although some of the things that WCF has don't look any worse.

rube · Post by **rube** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:43 am

Those are for an automatic. Doug Chase didn't make those by the way. There is no provision for an EGR valve.

That was my point. Apples and oranges.

They look better than WCF and the Fierostore offerings.

85'2m4 · Post by **85'2m4** » Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:45 am

Well primary length will affect the shape of the power curve. As well as where peak torque and hp are on that curve.

The Dark Side of Will · Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:59 am

Well... the way primary length interacts with cam duration affects those things. The same headers will tune the engine differently when used with different cams.

When the primary lengths are unequal, each cylinder has a slightly different VE curve and the engine can never be tuned correctly, and thus will never achieve it's potential power.

BigRedDeckSpoiler · Post by **BigRedDeckSpoiler** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 11:31 am

Sprints are $599, coated.
The new ones are $475, hi-temp painted.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 4:17 pm

So they bought a $5 rattle can from Home Depot and went to town. I certainly want those on my Fiero, especially when they are notorious for glowing the manifolds.

Kohburn · Post by **Kohburn** » Tue Aug 22, 2006 5:51 pm

Aaron wrote:So they bought a $5 rattle can from Home Depot and went to town. I certainly want those on my Fiero, especially when they are notorious for glowing the manifolds.

you are so full of shit.. fieros are no more notorious than any other 60*v6 for glowing manifolds that only happen when people are running lean (usually an unknown vac leak)

certainly nothing wrong with sprayed on ceramic paint.. since unless you get a real jethot coating thats all anybodyt does anyways be it rattle can or not.

most likely they are using a sprayer and a comercial high temp coating paint like you would buy from eastwood. rattle cans are not cost effective for commercial sales

that not enough for you? then tell em to leave it uncoated and send them somewhere else for coating with all the money you saved over the sprints

these are also much closer to equal length than the sprints that i remember seeing.