US screams bloody murder for 1000th

[EBSB52]

Why did you have to even post?

Here we go again...I'll be honest, I'm not even going to read it. Write 2 sentences and I will, if you want to write a book, go get a fucking blog.

Your post: 273 words. My post:232 words without quotes of other people. You once again make no sense. Your post has more of your words than does mine, yet you complain about me writing a book. IDIOT: YOUR POST IS LONGER THAN MINE. Don’t blame your short attention span or your inability to comprehend on me.

[EBSB52]

Clicked "stop watching this thread."

Reason: I'm a tard...

:salute: :thumbleft:

[V8Mikie]

I have my death penalty education from various criminal justice courses and the Catholic church which is of course against it as well.

Like I said, when you study it you realize that it accomplishes nothing. The Catholic church breaks it down very well, they go into the purposes of punishment and how the death penalty meets none of them.

Also, many feel the death penalty is racist with interesting statistics to back it up. No doubt that a black guy in a court in the deep south is already going into court with one strike against him. Just another reason to be against the death penalty.

To me, even if you disagree about everything else regarding the death penalty (not racist, it is a deterrent, etc.) I can't fathom how someone could support it knowing innocent people have been put to death or were about to be.

[EBSB52]

I have my death penalty education from various criminal justice courses and the Catholic church which is of course against it as well.

Like I said, when you study it you realize that it accomplishes nothing. The Catholic church breaks it down very well, they go into the purposes of punishment and how the death penalty meets none of them.

Also, many feel the death penalty is racist with interesting statistics to back it up. No doubt that a black guy in a court in the deep south is already going into court with one strike against him. Just another reason to be against the death penalty.

To me, even if you disagree about everything else regarding the death penalty (not racist, it is a deterrent, etc.) I can't fathom how someone could support it knowing innocent people have been put to death or were about to be.

100% agree. Notice how no one has responded to any of our arguments? It's one of those things where many people choose not to think, but to blindly back it w/o reason. Wag a picture of a 7-year old girl that was murdered and you can get al kinds of mileage for CP and fewer appeals.

Statistically, 2/3 of all Americans are for CP, but that # is shrinking. KInda funny how we consider Russia and many other CP abolishonist countries to be scum, yet we are less civilized that are they in some ways.

Even though high churches are against CP, most people who are pro-CP seem to have religious/Christian ties..... that Old Testament thing. Hell, the Old Testament supports antimiscegenation laws as well, so it needs to be buried for good.

[crzyone]

100% agree. Notice how no one has responded to any of our arguments?

[V8Mikie]

I have my death penalty education from various criminal justice courses and the Catholic church which is of course against it as well.

Like I said, when you study it you realize that it accomplishes nothing. The Catholic church breaks it down very well, they go into the purposes of punishment and how the death penalty meets none of them.

Also, many feel the death penalty is racist with interesting statistics to back it up. No doubt that a black guy in a court in the deep south is already going into court with one strike against him. Just another reason to be against the death penalty.

To me, even if you disagree about everything else regarding the death penalty (not racist, it is a deterrent, etc.) I can't fathom how someone could support it knowing innocent people have been put to death or were about to be.

100% agree. Notice how no one has responded to any of our arguments? It's one of those things where many people choose not to think, but to blindly back it w/o reason. Wag a picture of a 7-year old girl that was murdered and you can get al kinds of mileage for CP and fewer appeals.

Statistically, 2/3 of all Americans are for CP, but that # is shrinking. KInda funny how we consider Russia and many other CP abolishonist countries to be scum, yet we are less civilized that are they in some ways.

Even though high churches are against CP, most people who are pro-CP seem to have religious/Christian ties..... that Old Testament thing. Hell, the Old Testament supports antimiscegenation laws as well, so it needs to be buried for good.

Yea supporters of CP crack me up, when you get into a debate with them over the topic and they have no response to all of your arguments they always bring up the victims. I understand how tragic it is to have a loved one murdered, believe me, but killing someone else won't bring them back. Nothing will, and the sooner you accept that fact the sooner you can mentally recover from the loss. Even if someone tortured people will sticking a needle in his arm and "putting him to sleep" make him feel as much pain as his victim felt? What does it accomplish? BTW, the cause of death for the recent execution in MD is "homicide."

I was pro-death penalty at one time until I started to study it. People who say they are religious and support the death penalty are posers. Its like catholics who aren't against abortion, doesn't work that way. I had a bishop tell me once you are either in or you aren't, there is no in between.

As screwed up as the system is some people actually support them legally murdering people. The justice system never makes mistakes, right?

[The Dark Side of Will]

Waste of time I don't have, but I'm disgruntled after yet another 15 hour work day...

A minor who commited an act worthy of the death penalty is no longer a child.

Oh, so that same minor doesn’t have Constitutional rights, can serve in the military and die, can’t smoke, drink or vote, but can be held responsible via the belief that he/she is of age to understand his/her actions and the co0nsequences? blah blah fucking blah

Ad hominems aside...
Do you think that most 17 year olds understand the concepts of right and wrong? I do. What Constitutional rights does a 17 year old not have?

So how many "unnofficial" child executions have there been in the third world in the space of time that there have been 39 official child executions?

I don’t know, do you? What if we were only responsible for 25% instead of just below 50%, would that be so much more palatable?

I don't know. I asked you. You don't know. That means you're just spewing statistics that back your ideas, as usual.

Why stop counting back at 39?
Go to SE Asia and crusade against criminal trafficking in persons (as if there's any other kind of trafficking in persons).

That shows that you agree that the US is pathetic by the way you must compare us to the most egregious places on earth.

You compared the US to the rest of the world with your child executions statistic.

So is capital punishment unjust, or simply the implementation?

Uh, without the implementation of CP, there are no executions. Are you asking if the sentence is more unjust or the act of executing unjust? Clarify.

I'm asked you first, and yet again you are deliberately obtuse. I hate repeating myself.

What does capital punishment have to do with industrialization?

It’s a standard that is used to dichotomize what is expected from countries; industrialized versus non-industrialized.

Hitler's Germany was industrialized. Do you consider Saudi Arabia to be industrialized? Is cutting off someone's hand for stealing something a civilized punishment?
Civilizations run the gammut.

Should the American kid who vandalized cars in Singapore during the Clinton years have been caned?

Only if the people doing it feel they need to retribute for the sake of revenge. It teaches violence, but hell, we are about that, so WTF. SO if the kid grows up and beats people when they irritate him, we can scratch our heads wondering where he learned that.

Does not answer the question asked.

[p8ntman442]

Pay attention I will answer the questions.

A minor whom has committed a crime that warrants the death penalty has more problems than our criminal rehabilitation/punishment system can deal with. Their entire life in incarceration does nothing. WHat is a life in prison from the age of 17?

A cop killer is sentenced to death, yet you believe that he/she should be allowed the right to life, well I ask you, why wasnt the cop allowed the same. You can not justify the abolishment of capitol punishment on the basis that some innocent people have been put to death. It is the court systems duty to determine a persons guilt, there is where the changes need to be made, not in the end all be all of punishments.

Barring the "mistakes" made by the court system, look at the crimes that bring the death penalty. The only suitable punishment for these crimes is death, I believe these people are beyond rehabilitation, and therefore there is no point in keeping them locked up.

Prison systems should be revamped in order to help the inmates and prevent repeat offenders. Capital punishment is for those beyond this point.

[zonyl]

I was pro-death penalty at one time until I started to study it. People who say they are religious and support the death penalty are posers. Its like catholics who aren't against abortion, doesn't work that way. I had a bishop tell me once you are either in or you aren't, there is no in between.

Catholic Church told their followers they werent allowed to read and write at one time, told us the earth was the center of the universe, refute evoltion, etc which they all justified somehow to the masses (Supposedly the Vatican is still sitting on the St. Thomas writings which they consider us still not capable enough to read). I have zero credibility with the Catholic church's viewpoints. The bishop (likewise the church) is not perfect and there have been many points at which they have changed side and apoligized (vatican II?, Galileo trial?, Inquisition?). Posers are the ones that dont hold their beliefs and conform to what someone tells them.

Ill get as much information from others as I can, but I make my own judgements about CP and other issues without a third party's consent.

[Kohburn]

there have been many points at witch they have changed side and apoligized (vatican II?, Galileo trial?, Inquisition?). Posers are the ones that dont hold their beliefs and conform to what someone tells them.

Ill get as much information from others as I can, but I make my own judgements about CP and other issues without a third party's consent.

agreed

the Church is still made up of people, human, falible, people - it will never be flawless

[V8Mikie]

I was pro-death penalty at one time until I started to study it. People who say they are religious and support the death penalty are posers. Its like catholics who aren't against abortion, doesn't work that way. I had a bishop tell me once you are either in or you aren't, there is no in between.

Catholic Church told their followers they werent allowed to read and write at one time, told us the earth was the center of the universe, refute evoltion, etc which they all justified somehow to the masses (Supposedly the Vatican is still sitting on the St. Thomas writings which they consider us still not capable enough to read). I have zero credibility with the Catholic church's viewpoints. The bishop (likewise the church) is not perfect and there have been many points at which they have changed side and apoligized (vatican II?, Galileo trial?, Inquisition?). Posers are the ones that dont hold their beliefs and conform to what someone tells them.

Ill get as much information from others as I can, but I make my own judgements about CP and other issues without a third party's consent.

Get off your evangelical anti-Catholic horse for three seconds and consider one thing. The Church has been around for thousands of years unlike many of the Benny Hinn's churchs we now see pop up all over the place. Back in the beginnings of course things were taught very differently - the world was very different! America brought slaves over via the Middle Passage with a history of rape, torture and abuse when they got here. Women/children bought and sold like cattle, lucky to ever see freedom in their liftimes. Even before that injustice when colonists first got here this country was populated in case you didn't know. What happened to all those people? Well many massacres later we have obliterated the native american peoples and taken over their land.

So I guess we should hate this country as well for its mistakes by your reasoning, right? Death to America! Give me a fucking break. Any country/organization that has been around thousands of years has done something wrong along the way or what we view as wrong in the 21st century anyway.

BTW, that Bishop I spoke of has more intelligence on religious in his pinky toe then you will ever have. These are not mail order "reverends."

[V8Mikie]

Pay attention I will answer the questions.

A minor whom has committed a crime that warrants the death penalty has more problems than our criminal rehabilitation/punishment system can deal with. Their entire life in incarceration does nothing. WHat is a life in prison from the age of 17?

A cop killer is sentenced to death, yet you believe that he/she should be allowed the right to life, well I ask you, why wasnt the cop allowed the same.

You just proved my point through and through. Read the first line in my post where I quoted Eb.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory. ... le/3472872

[zonyl]

I was pro-death penalty at one time until I started to study it. People who say they are religious and support the death penalty are posers. Its like catholics who aren't against abortion, doesn't work that way. I had a bishop tell me once you are either in or you aren't, there is no in between.

Catholic Church told their followers they werent allowed to read and write at one time, told us the earth was the center of the universe, refute evoltion, etc which they all justified somehow to the masses (Supposedly the Vatican is still sitting on the St. Thomas writings which they consider us still not capable enough to read). I have zero credibility with the Catholic church's viewpoints. The bishop (likewise the church) is not perfect and there have been many points at which they have changed side and apoligized (vatican II?, Galileo trial?, Inquisition?). Posers are the ones that dont hold their beliefs and conform to what someone tells them.

Ill get as much information from others as I can, but I make my own judgements about CP and other issues without a third party's consent.

1. Get off your evangelical anti-Catholic horse for three seconds and consider one thing. 2. The Church has been around for thousands of years unlike many of the Benny Hinn's churchs we now see pop up all over the place. Back in the beginnings of course things were taught very differently - the world was very different! America brought slaves over via the Middle Passage with a history of rape, torture and abuse when they got here. Women/children bought and sold like cattle, lucky to ever see freedom in their liftimes. Even before that injustice when colonists first got here this country was populated in case you didn't know. What happened to all those people? Well many massacres later we have obliterated the native american peoples and taken over their land.

3.So I guess we should hate this country as well for its mistakes by your reasoning, right? Death to America! Give me a fucking break. 4.Any country/organization that has been around thousands of years has done something wrong along the way or what we view as wrong in the 21st century anyway.

5. BTW, that Bishop I spoke of has more intelligence on religious in his pinky toe then you will ever have. These are not mail order "reverends."

Yowser.

1. My problem is with the Catholic Church (infrastructure), not the general Catholic people. My beef in this topic is where people try to use this as a credible reason for backing up a position (ie. CP)

2. Yes, I understand this and is the basis of why I claimed the Catholic church is still making those mistakes even today in the 21st century, and will continue to do so. Your statement re-enforces my claim of no elevated credibility with the Catholic Church. In the 24th century people will still claim "Back in the beginnings of course things were taught very differently - the world was very different!" The world is as it always will be, full of people (in this case organizations) that make mistakes in equal amounts. What the Catholic Church tells me about an issue I take with as much credibility as a complete stranger.

3. Never used the word Hate. I claim the Catholic Church is not more credible as a source of consent on issues. Im not sure what you were trying to construe about my feelings with America, but I will say I hold no more credibilty for what the government here tells me either.

4. Not every organization in the world has had such an impact as the Catholic Church has in controlling as many lives. They claim (and you are backing it up) that they have higher standards of morality than any others.

5. Maybe he is, maybe not. Its a useless subjective statement unless you have something factual to share about his intelligence.

[V8Mikie]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10384331/

Should have killed this guy as well, no appeals for this bastard should have been granted!!

[zonyl]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/10384331/

Should have killed this guy as well, no appeals for this bastard should have been granted!!

Doesnt bode well for "Guilty without a doubt"

[p8ntman442]

Pay attention I will answer the questions.

A minor whom has committed a crime that warrants the death penalty has more problems than our criminal rehabilitation/punishment system can deal with. Their entire life in incarceration does nothing. WHat is a life in prison from the age of 17?

A cop killer is sentenced to death, yet you believe that he/she should be allowed the right to life, well I ask you, why wasnt the cop allowed the same.

You just proved my point through and through. Read the first line in my post where I quoted Eb.

http://www.chron.com/cs/CDA/printstory. ... le/3472872

Well I agree with your first sentence in that Killing a murderer will not bring anyone back. I propose that we take from them what they took from others. There has to be a cutoff point where you say, even if this person could be rehabilitated 100% would it be worth it. And of course The victims are a reason for supporting CP. With no victims there is no need for it. SO yup I WE agree.

[V8Mikie]

I say that life in a real prison would be more punishment for these people than merely sticking a needle in their arm and killing them. Someone else mentioned cheap labor. Something along those lines. I just have a problem with man deciding who dies and who doesn't knowing how flawed the nature of man is.

[Kohburn]

I say that life in a real prison would be more punishment for these people than merely sticking a needle in their arm and killing them. Someone else mentioned cheap labor. Something along those lines. I just have a problem with man deciding who dies and who doesn't knowing how flawed the nature of man is.

yeah but aparently hard labor and sleeping in tents is "inhumane"

[zonyl]

I say that life in a real prison would be more punishment for these people than merely sticking a needle in their arm and killing them. Someone else mentioned cheap labor. Something along those lines. I just have a problem with man deciding who dies and who doesn't knowing how flawed the nature of man is.

yeah but aparently hard labor and sleeping in tents is "inhumane"

I think there are two issues that are cluttered into one.

1. Is it right to punish those who are innocent? Of course not.
2. Is it right to kill someone for being definitely guilty? That is the debate.

Lets take variable 1 out of the equation (otherwise you would have to yield to no one should be punished ever) to effectively address ssue #2.

If I was guilty of comitting murder, I would rather be put to death immediately than sentenced to a life of hard labor. (V8mikie) Do I get a choice in your conceived system?

[Kohburn]

innocent or not - i'd rather get a needle than have to watch my bung hole in the shower for the rest of my life