Northstar build

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:03 pm

Nooooo!

Wanna hear 272 cams? Click here.

Yeah, it's got a bit of a lope... Sounds like a stock ls1 to me though, I'd like to hear some 282's or 288's... :thumbleft:

The Dark Side of Will · Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:20 pm

whipped wrote:
The Dark Side of Will wrote:I was designing billet 8620 roller blanks for Alan, but somebody else beat me to it. Haven't checked to see if they're on the website yet, but he told me over the phone that he has a source for billet blanks, which would bring the roller cam Northstars up to the same level of cam tunability that LS1's and other roller cam engines have.
Does that mean anything good for those of us without rollers?

Flat tappet cams need cast lobes in order to have any decent wear life at all. The material of choice is Proferal 55 (named for rockwell hardness).
I was trying to get blanks cast for the early engines, but it was going to be $20K for 200 units, which was too much for AJ to swallow at the time.

If an outfit could cast individual lobes at a reasonable price, then the lobes could be shrunk onto a steel shaft, much the same way GM assembles their cams

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:26 pm

That would probably be $2000 worth o' cam when it was finished... ouch. How do the quad cam mustang guys do it?

The Dark Side of Will · Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:28 pm

Economies of scale... and it still ain't cheap for them... What's a basic cast flat tappet cost for a small Chevy? multiply by 4.

The whole idea behind assemling the cams is that it's cheaper... For instance, the flat tappet N* cams are gun drilled almost all the way through and have cross drilled holes to oil the journals. This is a time consuming and expensive process. If assembling cams, one could start with hollow bar stock for the base and press cast lobes onto it, avoiding the gun drilling operation. The case lobes, since they're small could theoretically be made cheaply and in large quantities, then machined cheaply and installed.

Of course that would require the use of solid lifters (may be a Kawasaki unit that works) and increased base circle in order to get the wall thickness of the press on lobes up to something reasonable, but the bigger base circle means faster ramp rates for the same lift and overall duration...

Or you could press sleeves into the lifter bores and use the lifter bore galleries in the head to supply pressurized nitrogen and go with pneumatic valvesprings...

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 7:47 pm

whipped wrote:Nooooo!

Wanna hear 272 cams? Click here.

Yeah, it's got a bit of a lope... Sounds like a stock ls1 to me though, I'd like to hear some 282's or 288's... :thumbleft:

My God, that thing sounds fucking AWESOME.

Damn I like that.

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:04 pm

The Dark Side of Will wrote: Or you could press sleeves into the lifter bores and use the lifter bore galleries in the head to supply pressurized nitrogen and go with pneumatic valvesprings...

I don't have enough body parts I could sell to afford that.

I checked on the 4.6 mustang, and I guess they too are roller cams. $1400 for all 4 cams.

It would be neat to see a place with big pockets like comp cams to take up northstars... Dyno test everything... oh baby. :love4:

The Dark Side of Will · Wed Feb 15, 2006 8:07 pm

Dam, look at those lobes. Would love to have shit like that for the N*.

Of course those base circles are huge compared to what's in the N*.

Parde_GT · Post by **Parde_GT** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 12:50 am

Thanks for all your replies. Long day with work and school and I see many have responded since I last checked.

Amazing, I was watching that ebay listing for some time and had the very same thoughts on the flow #'s listed. I emailed the seller several times and only got back one response which was:

These are the sprockets that came with the cams from chrfab relocated just the same as degreeing the flow charts are in item description stock springs installed to correct spring height yes I will sell the pistons let me ask the boss and I'll get back to you Thanks

I was curious what his reserve was but didn't get a response back from him. I may try and email him again. It sounds as though he was using stock springs which I would need to change out.

Will, thanks for the info on the cams. I first tried sending Alan an email which I found out doesn't work well with contacting him so I then tried calling but no one answered. I may have to try again.

I was really in the dark as to how radical these grinds are. I do want a near stock idle. This doesn't need to be cadillac quality and I don't mind a little lope, just not radical. Maybe an idle around 800-900. Sounds like Crzyone and myself are aiming for close to the same output. Maybe I should look at 272 or just stay stock but with chrfab springs? Should I keep the sprockets stock or go with the 8 deg advance? I'd appreciate your thoughts on this.

Guess maybe I should have checked into this a bit more before I bought this 96' motor. I based this purchase on the wiring so as to not have to go to the $$ of the Big Stuff 3.

As far as wiring I was planning on the commander 950. I then came across the thread by Ryan Hess utilizing a 7730 ecm. I already have a 7730 as a couple years ago I was contemplating a tpi build. Buying a house got in the way and now I want to get back at it but instead with the N*. I PM'd Ryan and he seems pretty confident in his setup and providing a wiring harness so this may be the ticket. Sinister Fiero, Ryan indicated you may get involved in tuning with this?

As far as pistons this where I am not really sure what is the best route. I don't want to spend a fortune and I don't plan to hit 8K on a routine basis - just occaisionally (at least that's what I tell my self now, my foot may have other thoughts :thumbup: ). What's the cost of the cp's? Would stock be able to handle 400hp and an occaisional 8K? I thought I read somewhere they may. If the Arias are heavier than stock then they don't sound appropriate since I'm going NA.

I was planning on Specs alum flywheel for lighter weight.

I should also mention I am going to attempt to mate this to a getrag 284 that I have here. To complicate things a bit further (hell, why not) I have an 88 cradle to mount this on to go in my 87 gt.

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:24 am

Parde_GT wrote: I first tried sending Alan an email which I found out doesn't work well with contacting him so I then tried calling but no one answered. I may have to try again.

Yeah, they're tough little buggers to get ahold of. Took me a week of calling at different times before I didn't get the answering machine.

I then came across the thread by Ryan Hess utilizing a 7730 ecm.

That's me :thumbleft:

I'm going to start up a donation pool to get myself on the dyno, with a short runner intake on an otherwise stock northstar... anyone? anyone? $5 from 10 people, and you get to find out what it does! :blah5:

aww hell, I'll do it myself.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 10:54 am

I'll give $5 if you're serious :thumbleft:

Chase Race · Post by **Chase Race** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 1:42 pm

whipped wrote:
Parde_GT wrote: I then came across the thread by Ryan Hess utilizing a 7730 ecm.
That's me :thumbleft:

Whipped = Ryan Hess?

Didn't know that.

Kohburn · Post by **Kohburn** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:18 pm

Chase Race wrote:
whipped wrote:
Parde_GT wrote: I then came across the thread by Ryan Hess utilizing a 7730 ecm.
That's me :thumbleft:
Whipped = Ryan Hess?

Didn't know that.

me neither, but now that its been stated i can see it :thumbleft:

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:28 pm

Didn't you all read my dyno thread? Page 1? :scratch:

jstillwell · Post by **jstillwell** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:48 pm

Hell, I knew that.

Kohburn · Post by **Kohburn** » Thu Feb 16, 2006 8:57 pm

whipped wrote:Didn't you all read my dyno thread? Page 1? :scratch:

i mostly skim , and haven't been on the forums much lately anyways

Chase Race · Post by **Chase Race** » Fri Feb 17, 2006 1:28 pm

whipped wrote:Didn't you all read my dyno thread? Page 1? :scratch:

Yep. I guess I got confused by the uber-kewl cyber-speak and didn't know wtf you meant by:

whipped wrote:hell yeah dude... teh whipzor = ryan.hess on OE.

I've got it now.

jstillwell wrote:Hell, I knew that.

Yeah, right. Next you're going to tell me that you're the same person as Stimpy.

Parde_GT · Post by **Parde_GT** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:02 pm

Question, will a 2K intake work on an earlier engine? They have a cleaner look to them.

jstillwell · Post by **jstillwell** » Sun Feb 19, 2006 11:18 pm

Chase Race wrote:
jstillwell wrote:Hell, I knew that.
Yeah, right. Next you're going to tell me that you're the same person as Stimpy.

Fuck no, that guy is a derelict.

whipped · Post by **whipped** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 10:07 am

Parde_GT wrote:Question, will a 2K intake work on an earlier engine? They have a cleaner look to them.

Sorry for the thread hijack...

I'm going to guess, no. The intake ports are shaped differently for starters, and with the 2000 engines, the throttle body mounts on the water crossover, so you'd need that too...

crzyone · Post by **crzyone** » Mon Feb 20, 2006 1:04 pm

whipped wrote:
Parde_GT wrote:Question, will a 2K intake work on an earlier engine? They have a cleaner look to them.
with the 2000 engines, the throttle body mounts on the water crossover, so you'd need that too...

What I thought was a coolant line on the top of the TB was actually a brake booster vacume line and the smaller line which I thought was a brake booster line was actually a breather from the cam cover. I'm not even sure if its a heated TB, but it is bolted to the waterlog.

Here is my 2003 intake runners. The front of the intake slips into the rubber ring which connects to the TB and the runners are bolted to the heads. Very simple setup.